LNP and Surrogacy

[ellicat]

The Greens are coming and I have been shouting and shouting for the benefit of myself and others. Even the ones that are wet behind the ears, although they often post to abuse me.

I could not care less about any person other than those I know and love and to a lesser extent Australians in general. The world's problems are caused by overpopulation. I despise charities like World Vision that interfere with natural selection and perpetuate problems around the world. It seems to me that places like Ethopia are uninhabitable except on a nomadic basis. That is the way it has always been. To save people that keep going there famine after famine is ridiculous. Spend the money on setting these people in areas that are habitable and only need some infrastructure to succeed. It's like putting people in the Simpson Desert to live only to have to send out letters around the world to raise money to feed and water them - a fools game.

I could not care less about Syrians getting killed. It does not effect me.

I like to pay notice to places like Spain, Greece, California. These are places where either over zealous Greens have had their way with the economy to the point of economic disaster and no betterment of their environment (Spain, California) and economic disaster from a lazy population with a way too heavy socialist policy. I pay attention to those because it does effect me or shows strong signs of effecting me.

I hate the Greens for rational logical reasons without any spin-doctoring, rhetorical, political-parroting excuses.

Also because "The aliens are coming"---Bob Brown 2012

[Manni79]

It's threads like these that turns friends in to enemies.....

Thanks for the report enjoyed the pics

[haines490slc]

Couldn't care less as long as it is not pushing lies and rubbish that effects me, like The Greens.

so if a foreign country like syria kills innocent people, you couldn't care less, how about the holocaust? Brian, ever heard this poem??

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out--

Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out--

Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out--

Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me.

Come on Eddie that is a long bow to draw comparing our system with Nazi Germany and quoting Martin Niemöller. Let us have some perspective in the argument.

not doing that at all, just pointing out to brian that he doesn't care about anything that doesn't affect him, he wouldn't care about the holocaust and human rights abuses that occur around the world

[haines490slc]

I like to pay notice to places like Spain, Greece, California. These are places where either over zealous Greens have had their way with the economy to the point of economic disaster and no betterment of their environment (Spain, California)

your funny brian, so it had nothing to do with people going on a debt binge once countries like Greece, Ireland, Spain entered the Euro and hence enjoyed the lower interest rates associated with it. The GFC was caused by capitalists mate, and socialism is bailing it out, you are funny.

[haines490slc]

It's threads like these that turns friends in to enemies.....

Thanks for the report enjoyed the pics

yeah, but isn't it nice that we can openly discuss opinions, even if they differ, without the threat of being bound up, gagged and shot and shoved into a shallow grave like in some parts of the world, and at the end of the day, can still go fishing together, and have a beer together even though we may be polar opposites in political views

[crazywalrus]

It's threads like these that turns friends in to enemies.....

Thanks for the report enjoyed the pics

Both these guys enjoy the banter Manni - Always good to watch. :whistle:

[ellicat]

I like to pay notice to places like Spain, Greece, California. These are places where either over zealous Greens have had their way with the economy to the point of economic disaster and no betterment of their environment (Spain, California)

your funny brian, so it had nothing to do with people going on a debt binge once countries like Greece, Ireland, Spain entered the Euro and hence enjoyed the lower interest rates associated with it. The GFC was caused by capitalists mate, and socialism is bailing it out, you are funny.

Haha. You are just ignorant. Spain and California were going down the gurgler way before the GFC hit. So no it is not all to do with that. I've been interested a bit longer than than the last five minutes.

[haines490slc]

I like to pay notice to places like Spain, Greece, California. These are places where either over zealous Greens have had their way with the economy to the point of economic disaster and no betterment of their environment (Spain, California)

your funny brian, so it had nothing to do with people going on a debt binge once countries like Greece, Ireland, Spain entered the Euro and hence enjoyed the lower interest rates associated with it. The GFC was caused by capitalists mate, and socialism is bailing it out, you are funny.

Haha. You are just ignorant. Spain and California were going down the gurgler way before the GFC hit. So no it is not all to do with that. I've been interested a bit longer than than the last five minutes.

rather be ignorant than have no morals and not care about atrocities committed around the world mate. :kiss:

[rayke1938]

It's threads like these that turns friends in to enemies.....

Yes wish someone would say something really radical and offensive so that the mods would lock the post and I can get on with packing for the winter camp.

Joe was my uncle and the number of people that he ripped off both prior and after entering parliament was astounding.

He was a truly evil and corrupt person.

Whilst he certainly expanded the economy and provided new infrastructure if you look behind every project there was something for him or his mates.

When he was brigalow clearing he was banned by every fuel agent on the darling downs.

Cheers

Ray

[shortie]

It's threads like these that turns friends in to enemies.....

Thanks for the report enjoyed the pics

That will only happen if people can't see the funny side and take everything literally

[Swagger]

I like to pay notice to places like Spain, Greece, California. These are places where either over zealous Greens have had their way with the economy to the point of economic disaster and no betterment of their environment (Spain, California)

your funny brian, so it had nothing to do with people going on a debt binge once countries like Greece, Ireland, Spain entered the Euro and hence enjoyed the lower interest rates associated with it. The GFC was caused by capitalists mate, and socialism is bailing it out, you are funny.

Haha. You are just ignorant. Spain and California were going down the gurgler way before the GFC hit. So no it is not all to do with that. I've been interested a bit longer than than the last five minutes.

rather be ignorant than have no morals and not care about atrocities committed around the world mate. :kiss:

Using your Syria example, so because you care about atrocities around the world, you have decided to sell your expensive fishing gear and buy second-hand Jarvis Walker reels, rods and tackle and donate all that extra money, along with any of your savings, to innocent children in Syria? I think not

There is a difference between "caring" and "doing". Caring is sympathy, good in a sense and makes your thoughts morally acceptable to society but you are achieving nothing that shows an improved result to an overseas situation. Doesn't make you a better person just because you care.

Millions of less fortunate situations happen here and across the world, that has nothing to contribute to the title of this thread

Agree with Ray, thread should be locked. How offensive can I be to lock the thread and not get banned?

[robin]

You know, My brother inlaw is gay, and to be honest I really don't care as he bleeds the same color I bleed and breaths the same air, and to be really honest, I may have had a different view with gay people untill i met my bro inlaw, and I accept them more now then I used to.

People are scared of the unknown, they are scared if someone is different, this is the same issue when colored people wanted to do the same as every one else, over time we learnt to accept them, I'm living proof, I never used to like Asian people and yet I ended up marrying a Chines woman and we are having our first baby, and now most of my friends are Asians.

As far as them having kids and getting married, I don't see the problem with that, there are so many families that i have seen where they let there kids run around at night doing what ever they want and the parents just don't care about them, I believe that with gays if they want to have kids, i honestly believe that they will really look after them really well and probley better then most families, whats the difference between a gay man or woman having a child and baby sitting, nothing.

[ellicat]

Yes Robin, but what if it is like I said in an earlier post -

But what if both parents are Greens ? :ohmy: It shouldn't be allowed in that case.

Or even worse than that, what if both parents AND the surrogate are Greens. :ohmy: :ohmy: :sick:

[shortie]

My house is bigger thanks yours

Is the goverent going to build you 1 the same size

There is al ways the haves and have nots

Unless you want to try and perfect communisism

I can have kids naturally you can't

Boo flippin hoo

Hey I'm the most discriminated against type in society because aparently I have everything I need

White middle aged male married middle class

I buy my own house and land

Never claimed welfare

Never got austudy cause dad apparently was

Above the threshhd

Get no family assistance because I found an averrage paying job

Get no child care assistance cause the

Mrs and I both earn average wages

Cry me a river

Screw all the bleeding hearts why can't the government look after

Me. Just because I got off my ass and did something for myself

Maybe I should declare myself

Aboriginal call myself gay not work for a living then bleeding hearts

Will want to give me everything because I'm owed a life by society

[Gary_C]

My house is bigger thanks yours

Is the goverent going to build you 1 the same size

There is ways the haves and have nots

Unless you want to try and perfect communisism

I can have kids naturally you can't

Boo fecken hoo

I think the point is though Shortie that if your shorty was on the fritz and you could not have a kid naturally for some reason, the government would be okay with you hiring a woman to have the baby in your wife's stead. However, if you were not married, then you could not.

I'm not sure that something like surrogacy should be treated like a ride at Movie World. "You must be this tall to ride this ride" doesn't quite apply. Either put forth a blanket ban or open it up to everybody.

May as well say, "Embryonic stem cell harvesting is illegal, unless the embryo has one Asian parent."

[shortie]

My house is bigger thanks yours

Is the goverent going to build you 1 the same size

There is ways the haves and have nots

Unless you want to try and perfect communisism

I can have kids naturally you can't

Boo fecken hoo

I think the point is though Shortie that if your shorty was on the fritz and you could not have a kid naturally for some reason, the government would be okay with you hiring a woman to have the baby in your wife's stead. However, if you were not married, then you could not.

I'm not sure that something like surrogacy should be treated like a ride at Movie World. "You must be this tall to ride this ride" doesn't quite apply. Either put forth a blanket ban or open it up to everybody.

May as well say, "Embryonic stem cell harvesting is illegal, unless the embryo has one Asian parent."

If my Shorty was on the fritz and i couldnt father children then that would be to bloody bad for me. I would move on.

As i said life is different for everyone. You live with what you are dealt.

Cant expect governments to legislate for every concievable circumstance. But anyways is doesnt affect me so i dont really give a shoot.

But i do however believe that parenthood should be a privilage not a right. Yes even in a male/female relationship.

Lets legislate to stop the ignorant, dumb, abusive twits of this world breeding.

[Manni79]

Hey I'm the most discriminated against type in society because aparently I have everything I need

White middle aged male married middle class

I buy my own house and land

Never claimed welfare

Never got austudy cause dad apparently was

Above the threshhd

Get no family assistance because I found an averrage paying job

Get no child care assistance cause the

Mrs and I both earn average wages

Cry me a river

Screw all the bleeding hearts why can't the government look after

Me. Just because I got off my ass and did something for myself

That's so true and unfortunately will never change !!!

[Gary_C]

I personally will never use a surrogate, nor will I ever need one. However, the fact that a married couple can access one because she doesn't want to ruin her figure by getting pregnant while the other singles, same sex couples, or defacto partners cannot is abhorrent to me. You are either for equal rights or you are not; apathy towards injustice can be just as bad as outright support.

My perfect government would follow 2 main principles.

1: Unless it has a very high probability of harming other individuals or restricting their rights, it will remain legal. (Allow civil courts to handle those things that "might" cause harm to another IF it does cause harm to another).

2: All other legislation will restrict the government's ability to interfere in my life.

I don't really have a say in this one (at least until I have to make the decision on whether I want to give up my US citizenship to become an Australian citizen) but it certainly seems to be a hot button topic.

[Swagger]

I personally will never use a surrogate, nor will I ever need one. However, the fact that a married couple can access one because she doesn't want to ruin her figure by getting pregnant while the other singles, same sex couples, or defacto partners cannot is abhorrent to me. You are either for equal rights or you are not; apathy towards injustice can be just as bad as outright support.

My perfect government would follow 2 main principles.

1: Unless it has a very high probability or harming other individuals or restricting their rights, it will remain legal. (Allow civil courts to handle those things that "might" cause harm to another IF it does cause harm to another).

2: All other legislation will restrict the government's ability to interfere in my life.

I don't really have a say in this one (at least until I have to make the decision on whether I want to give up my US citizenship to become and Australian citizen) but it certainly seems to be a hot button topic.

My perfect government would follow two principles:

1. Give a $10,000 fishing handout to all fisherman

2. Fisherman to be exempt from tax

[crazywalrus]

As far as them having kids and getting married, I don't see the problem with that, there are so many families that i have seen where they let there kids run around at night doing what ever they want and the parents just don't care about them, I believe that with gays if they want to have kids, i honestly believe that they will really look after them really well and probley better then most families, whats the difference between a gay man or woman having a child and baby sitting, nothing.

Hey Robin - I am not giving a opinion here merely stating that we can not look to the worst of society to make out point and try and sway our argument. I am sure in every community, straight, Gay, single, black, white and other there are poor examples to draw upon this does not make your argument any more persuasive either way.

[Avitir]

I like to pay notice to places like Spain, Greece, California. These are places where either over zealous Greens have had their way with the economy to the point of economic disaster and no betterment of their environment (Spain, California)

your funny brian, so it had nothing to do with people going on a debt binge once countries like Greece, Ireland, Spain entered the Euro and hence enjoyed the lower interest rates associated with it. The GFC was caused by capitalists mate, and socialism is bailing it out, you are funny.

Don't know what political ideology has been in control of the nations going down the gurgler but, the GFC was caused by idiots plain and simple- idiots come in all political colours. Should also point out to balance the argument that it is all capitalism's fault that the sub-prime crisis was essentially rooted in socialist policy that came in a capitalist wrapper. Substandard policy and a lack of intestinal fortitude at times from all parties across the world caused these problems not ideologies.

[ellicat]

Talking long before GFC, Avitir

[Avitir]

Talking long before GFC, Avitir

And a lot of this is based long before the GFC. Poor policy decisions lead to things like the GFC or what is going on right now. Problem is it is all compounded by more poor decisions right at this moment.

[Bi_polar]

Looking after the bible bangers.

My opinion live and let live,

If people wish to go through the process they will only go overseas or interstate so the law change will not achieve anything except send people and money out of the state.

Pity they cannot spend their time reviewing the fisheries act but then they would actually think and not be led by the nose.

Cheers'Ray

X2

[ellicat]

Talking long before GFC, Avitir

And a lot of this is based long before the GFC. Poor policy decisions lead to things like the GFC or what is going on right now. Problem is it is all compounded by more poor decisions right at this moment.

Totally irrelevant argument. We're not discussing the GFC, we're discussing the ill-effects if Greenisms. Maybe talk about the Californian economy to 2007 and the negative impact greenisms have had there for the two prior decades and you would be relevant to this discussion. Maybe even talk about Spain and it's massive unemployment rate due to loss of industry due the "green jobs' that were created there that didn't quite cover the losses such as Nissan going to Thailand for example.

Just remember to never go to California as you will get cancer as from what I've noticed on labelling is that just about everything may give you cancer in California