Looking for opinions on heavy spinning popper rods.

[Ed.]

Hi guys, I am looking for a heavy spinning popper rod approximately 7'9" to 8'2" in length in a 2 piece PE6 to PE8 spinning, the reel I will add to it is a Penn Spinfisher SSVI8500LL (X'Mas pressie from the Wifey), I have been looking around and very few stores have any to look at (and none that are local to me) so I have to buy one sight unseen. Looks like I will have to get one based on specs and other peoples opinions. Price range about $300 approx. Has anyone got any recommendations or used any of the following rods which I have shortlisted, any likes or dislikes on any of them. As these rods are fairly specialized I need first hand experience only.

I do have an 8ft popper spinning rod based on a Calstar graphfighter blank but it is more suited to my 6500 sized reel and not the 8500 sized reel, also it is one piece so traveling with it will be a pain hence the reason for wanting a 2 piece.

Penn Ocean Assassin OA-822xxh PE6-PE8
Daiwa Saltist Hyper rod ST82XH PE8
Daiwa Demon Blood 82XH PE8
Shimano Terez TZS80GT 50-80lb

Cheers
Ed.

[Drop Bear]

I bought the Penn,

It is a great rod for the price. It casts a heavy lure for miles. I have only battled some smallish Tuna on it so cant give a critique on it under load. 

I used a Venom a while ago. It was a BEAST but you can get 3 Penns for the same price... I don't do enough of that type of fishing to justify one. 

[Ed.]

Drop Bear: which model of Penn rod did you get and what reel did you put on it? I rang Pure Fishing to see if my 8500LL reel would fit it and they said they will get back to me, still waiting, might have to give them a call back. Apparently there is a V2 of the Venoms out and the price has increased to about the $400 range, so like you don't want to spend that sort of dollars for something that will only be used rarely.

I am hedging towards the Penn myself, heard there were some issues with the Terez's and I do not like the Shimano company as a whole, so I suppose my order of preferences would be as per the list.

[Ed.]

Found another potential rod but as usual no one I know has them in stock : Okuma Pressure Point Spin PP-S-792H

[Drop Bear]

On 10/12/2020 at 8:37 AM, Ed. said:

Drop Bear: which model of Penn rod did you get and what reel did you put on it? I rang Pure Fishing to see if my 8500LL reel would fit it and they said they will get back to me, still waiting, might have to give them a call back. Apparently there is a V2 of the Venoms out and the price has increased to about the $400 range, so like you don't want to spend that sort of dollars for something that will only be used rarely.

I am hedging towards the Penn myself, heard there were some issues with the Terez's and I do not like the Shimano company as a whole, so I suppose my order of preferences would be as per the list.

I will get you the model sorry don't know if off the top of my head. 

Put a 25k Saragosa with 80lb braid on it. 

[Ed.]

Thanks Drop Bear. Outback Adventures received a shipment of gear and they got the Penn Ocean Assassin 802XXH in, so went in and had a feel, and whilst it was quite affordable it didn't entice me to buy it, considering it was PE8-10 rated, the winch seat seemed very flimsy to me,  so the search continues, I like a more substantial feel to my rods especially heavy rods. Looks like more fishing tackle is starting to filter into the stores.

[Guest]

5 hours ago, Ed. said:

Thanks Drop Bear. Outback Adventures received a shipment of gear and they got the Penn Ocean Assassin 802XXH in, so went in and had a feel, and whilst it was quite affordable it didn't entice me to buy it, considering it was PE8-10 rated, the winch seat seemed very flimsy to me,  so the search continues, I like a more substantial feel to my rods especially heavy rods. Looks like more fishing tackle is starting to filter into the stores.

Have you checked out allround angler at caboolture Ed ?  They have a bit of everything in there 

[Ed.]

I haven't as yet but I will probably pop in there during the week, will also go to the Lawnton Tackle world as I think they may have got some new stock in.

[Guest]

I've only been in Freddy's once but I've heard they have some good specials sometimes . Maybe check them out too . 

[Ed.]

Just popped in to Allround Tackle at Caboolture, he had 2 which were about $150-170 each, the Shimano Revolution wasn't too bad but it was a little bit soft being PE4-PE8, but I wouldn't be confident on using it with a locked up spool. The other one had the guides at 180 degrees out from where they  should be so totally rejected it. (one of my pet hates). He had a few of the Wilson Venom rods there but they were north of $600 so ruled those out to.

Some time next week or so, I will pop in to the Lawnton Tackle world store as they seem have a few of the other  popping sticks there, Also will drop in to Freddy's on the way back, although when I rang them the other day they had low stocks but maybe they have had some shipments come in since then so the hunt continues.

[Guest]

42 minutes ago, Ed. said:

Just popped in to Allround Tackle at Caboolture, he had 2 which were about $150-170 each, the Shimano Revolution wasn't too bad but it was a little bit soft being PE4-PE8, but I wouldn't be confident on using it with a locked up spool. The other one had the guides at 180 degrees out from where they  should be so totally rejected it. (one of my pet hates). He had a few of the Wilson Venom rods there but they were north of $600 so ruled those out to.

Some time next week or so, I will pop in to the Lawnton Tackle world store as they seem have a few of the other  popping sticks there, Also will drop in to Freddy's on the way back, although when I rang them the other day they had low stocks but maybe they have had some shipments come in since then so the hunt continues.

Bummer , thought they would have had something to suit poppers for sure other than venoms ,  I knew they had Penn gear and diawa and shimano too . Sorry mate thought for sure the boys in there would have been able to help you out , always been very good to me and got whatever I asked for.

[Ed.]

No problems, I wanted to have a look there anyway as they aren't too far away from me.

[Drop Bear]

It is the bottom one.

[Ed.]

Had a look at the that one at Outback Adventures. The guy there even put a 8500 slammer on it for me, but to my mind the first guide ring on it should have been a larger size and further up towards the tip sort of in between where the existing guides are. Using a 6500 sized reel would have worked OK but not on the 8500 sized reel. I have a similar sort of setup on the other popper rod I made, works OK when using the 6500 but unfortunately the 8500 sits further away from the blank so when casting the line coming off the spools  has too much resistance when slapping the first guide, as the angle is wrong and the guide is too small.

It would work from a boat when bottom bashing and little bit of casting away from the boat, but you loose too much distance when casting a long way away.

[Drop Bear]

On 13/12/2020 at 9:23 AM, Ed. said:

Had a look at the that one at Outback Adventures. The guy there even put a 8500 slammer on it for me, but to my mind the first guide ring on it should have been a larger size and further up towards the tip sort of in between where the existing guides are. Using a 6500 sized reel would have worked OK but not on the 8500 sized reel. I have a similar sort of setup on the other popper rod I made, works OK when using the 6500 but unfortunately the 8500 sits further away from the blank so when casting the line coming off the spools  has too much resistance when slapping the first guide, as the angle is wrong and the guide is too small.

It would work from a boat when bottom bashing and little bit of casting away from the boat, but you loose too much distance when casting a long way away.

It cast pretty well with the 25,000 on it with big poppers but like I said I didn't give it a huge test out as we were mostly bottom bashing with baits. 4 days goes so fast haha. 

[Ed.]

3 hours ago, Drop Bear said:

It cast pretty well with the 25,000 on it with big poppers but like I said I didn't give it a huge test out as we were mostly bottom bashing with baits. 4 days goes so fast haha. 

Especially when your fishing! I am going to Tackle World on Thursday as they have a selection to choose from including 2 of the Okuma ones I asked them to get in for a look. If I still can't find one I like it will probably be time to look at making something. I could modify the one I have but it is 8ft long and I would like a 2 piece rod  for traveling.

Found an interesting rod setup on E-Bay. https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/JIG-POP-POPPER-POPPING-ROD-3-Piece-Heavy-Duty-Rod/293159271307?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649

However that one will definitely require some quide replacements. The first stripper is about 53cm away from the reel seat and it is only 30mm wide, my current one is about 76cm away and it is 40mm wide and that guide ring is still too close to the blank especially using the size of reel I am using. I might see if I can get some Hi frame guides  as that should do the trick.  I sort of like the one in the link as it is a handle that accepts a jigging top part or a popping part, and it comes with both.

[Junky]

On 12/12/2020 at 11:27 AM, Ed. said:

.The other one had the guides at 180 degrees out from where they  should be so totally rejected it. (one of my pet hates).

Do you mean the guides are on top of the blank if you were holding it normally when fishing? 

[Ed.]

Yes, when you put a bend on a rod blank, the blank wants to flick into a certain position and the backbone is at the top. So on a  spinning rod when you put a bend in the rod blank the backbone flicks to the top and then the rod maker lines up the guides  underneath as well as the reel seat, on a overhead rod, the rod maker  places the guides on the top of the blank where the backbone is as well as the reel seat.  So as an example, the effect  on an overhead is, if you were to put the guides side on to the backbone as in 90 degrees out, when you fight a fish the rod will want to twist out of your hand.

Think of the rod blank as your spine and rib cage, so when you bend, the spine is at the top of the bend, so on an overhead rod the guides go on top and on a spinning rod they go underneath. On the the rod that was 180 degrees out, the rod positioned it self  as it would normally  do with the spine on top and the spinning guides swung out to the top and not underneath where they should be.

I hope I have explained it well enough, it is easier to show someone rather than explain it.

Here is a link from Youtube, you may have to fiddle with the sound a bit.

 

[AUS-BNE-FISHO]

Good luck with the quest for the rod Ed. I hope you can find one that works for you.

Cheers Hamish  

[Ed.]

Thanks Hamish, when you have made a few rods you tend to get very fussy and nothing cheezes you off more than finding a commercially made one that isn't built right, as in the guides aren't in the right alignment , not enough of them or in the wrong spots, wrong height and size, especially so when you are spending hundreds of dollars for a rod.

[Andrew_P]

Mate just make one! Then you can’t complain about it Rainshadow do a nice 2 piece butt joint tuna popping blank for around $150USD. 
https://www.rainshadowrodblanks.com/product-line/tunapopper/

[Ed.]

So who sells them here in Queensland?

[Andrew_P]

Aaron McKell imports/distributes them 

https://acmcustomrods.com/collections/rainshadow-rod-blanks

 

[Junky]

10 hours ago, Ed. said:

Yes, when you put a bend on a rod blank, the blank wants to flick into a certain position and the backbone is at the top. So on a  spinning rod when you put a bend in the rod blank the backbone flicks to the top and then the rod maker lines up the guides  underneath as well as the reel seat, on a overhead rod, the rod maker  places the guides on the top of the blank where the backbone is as well as the reel seat.  So as an example, the effect  on an overhead is, if you were to put the guides side on to the backbone as in 90 degrees out, when you fight a fish the rod will want to twist out of your hand.

Think of the rod blank as your spine and rib cage, so when you bend, the spine is at the top of the bend, so on an overhead rod the guides go on top and on a spinning rod they go underneath. On the the rod that was 180 degrees out, the rod positioned it self  as it would normally  do with the spine on top and the spinning guides swung out to the top and not underneath where they should be.

I hope I have explained it well enough, it is easier to show someone rather than explain it.

Here is a link from Youtube, you may to fiddle with the sound a bit.

 

Ahh copy. Now I know what you're saying. 

 

I was picturing the guides at 180° from the reel seat. 

[samsteele115]

I think the penn ocean assassin has been pretty nice to use mate, for its low price point!

[Ed.]

The rod that I looked at was bound like it was an overhead in relation to the spine.

[samsteele115]

2 minutes ago, Ed. said:

The rod that I looked at was bound like it was an overhead in relation to the spine.

Probably, it ain't high end. I don't know lots about rods tbh haha all I cared about is it stopped fish!

[Drop Bear]

16 minutes ago, samsteele115 said:

Probably, it ain't high end. I don't know lots about rods tbh haha all I cared about is it stopped fish!

I'm the same. I have made rods in the past but I don't check the spine these days when purchasing a rod. Perhaps I should. I might just be getting lazy in my old age...

Hopefully I won't need to purchase any rods for a while anyhow. 

 

[Ed.]

Just contacted that importer that Andrey_P gave a link to and price wise it is going to be too expensive for what I want to spend, probably $600+, as the imported blank is about $250 on it's own, he imports the blanks and builds to suit. He is in Innisfail, so going for a drive up there to have a look at it is out. I am off to look at the Okumas and a couple of others this morning as they have arrived at Lawnton, so hopefully my search will be over.

[Andrew_P]

@Ed. Innisfail is still Qld

I agree - it sucks having to purchase blanks sight unseen and paying top dollar for them, but with no blank manufacturers left in Australia that is the situation. 
you could go a Calstar from Ross @ the Rodworks but he is in South Australia and for an 8ft H-XH blank you will be looking at north of $350 for the blank alone, plus delivery from Adelaide. 
 

Australia isn’t even a pimple on the bum of the US market so it’s little wonder we struggle getting products here. 

[Ed.]

4 hours ago, Andrew_P said:

@Ed. Innisfail is still Qld

I agree - it sucks having to purchase blanks sight unseen and paying top dollar for them, but with no blank manufacturers left in Australia that is the situation. 
you could go a Calstar from Ross @ the Rodworks but he is in South Australia and for an 8ft H-XH blank you will be looking at north of $350 for the blank alone, plus delivery from Adelaide. Australia isn’t even a pimple on the bum of the US market so it’s little wonder we struggle getting products here. 

The last blanks I got that were made locally were the SnyderGlas  ones, I bought 3 of them just before they were bought  by Wilson?  One of them is a prototype and there were only 2 of them ever made and as far as I know the owner has the other one.

I had already visited the Rodworks site and had a look at the Calstars but they only come in a single piece blank so I would have had to work out how to fit some sort of removable handle for it. My existing Popper rod is a Calstar GF900H cut down from the bottom and a bit from the top to make it 8"1" and as I said I needed a 2 piece rod.

But anyway problem solved and I have success at last, went down to Tackle World Lawnton this morning and had a look at all their popping rods under $400 including the 2 Okuma Pressure Point rods they got in for me, so in total about 6-7 rods.  The lighter PE 6-8 Okuma I ruled out as the guides were out of position in regards to the backbone, (and you know what my thoughts are on that subject) the second Okuma PP-S-792XH PE-8 was fine and I short listed it to number 2 spot, and the one that was most suitable out of them all for my SSVI8500LL reel, and  which I bought is the Shimano Anthem SW Stick bait GT Spin 792 GTPE8-10 Lure weight 100-250gm.

Only negative issue to it is it doesn't have a rod gimble cap on the bottom, but that is an easy fix so will change it soonish when I get the part in after X'Mas. The RRP was $349 and got it for $325 so still within my price range. Now I can stop searching and relax .

[Drop Bear]

18 hours ago, Ed. said:

SSVI8500LL

How much drag can they go to? 

I thought you would need a bigger reel. I hate big heavy reels so would love to have an alternative. 

[Ed.]

Hi Drop Bear, this one does 18.1 Kg/40lb which for me is more than enough, the only way you are going to hold on to a 8' rod with the drag at max is if the rod is pointing semi horizontally towards the fish when it tries to swim back to the reel wall, but once you stop it in it's tracks then you can use the pump and wind technique. This is due to leverage being against you, so when you stop it's first run that is when your fun starts, and if you cant stop it then it's all over anyway as you will be bricked on the coral. So if you can stop it's first run then you have a fighting chance.  Holding a rod with that length  and 40lb drag in any sort of vertical position on it is almost impossible.  

The Spinfishers also come in larger sizes too but not in the Liveliner version. The biggest is the SSVI BX 10500 which does 22.6Kg and it is a huge reel but make no mistake the SSVI8500LL is also a large reel, hence the reason I had trouble finding a rod to suit it. If bottom bashing only then it's not that much of an issue but casting poppers long distance you will loose a lot of distance because of line slap.

There are other big reels depending on the model that put out much more drag such as the Shimano Twin Power reels 25-28Kg and the Okuma Makaira Spin 25-30Kg reels but they are 3 to 4 times the price.  This one I paid $199 for it from BCF which has a special on them at the moment (and free delivery if you spend more than $99.) and they were the only store I found that had stock unless I wanted to pay full retail.

I would have preferred to use an overhead as they are much nicer to fish with but the overhead reels with that much drag are huge, and they don't cast well at all IMO because of the size and weight of the spool plus over run issues, ie: Talica 12 & 16 (18kg), so this one for me is a cheap but better compromise. You need  long rods to get the distance but then you have leverage against you, and you will have to get a custom made long rod for an overhead.

 

[Ed.]

@Drop Bear , if you are still interested in these sort reels, BCF just sent me their latest catalogue and they still have them on special, the one I bought which is the SSV8500ll still at $199.00 and the non liveliner versions SSVI BX 9500 for $159 and the  SSVI BX 8500 for $199, but I suggest you check them out first physically as you said you don't like big reels.

https://www.bcf.com.au/p/penn-spinfisher-ssvi-live-liner-8500ll-spinning-reel/565063.html?cgid=BCF031005

https://www.bcf.com.au/p/penn-spinfisher-ssvi-bx-8500-spinning-reel/565056.html?cgid=BCF031005

https://www.bcf.com.au/p/penn-spinfisher-ssvi-bx-9500-spinning-reel/565057.html?cgid=BCF031005

 

 

 

[Drop Bear]

38 minutes ago, Ed. said:

@Drop Bear , if you are still interested in these sort reels, BCF just sent me their latest catalogue and they still have them on special, the one I bought which is the SSV8500ll still at $199.00 and the non liveliner versions SSVI BX 9500 for $159 and the  SSVI BX 8500 for $199, but I suggest you check them out first physically as you said you don't like big reels.

https://www.bcf.com.au/p/penn-spinfisher-ssvi-live-liner-8500ll-spinning-reel/565063.html?cgid=BCF031005

https://www.bcf.com.au/p/penn-spinfisher-ssvi-bx-8500-spinning-reel/565056.html?cgid=BCF031005

https://www.bcf.com.au/p/penn-spinfisher-ssvi-bx-9500-spinning-reel/565057.html?cgid=BCF031005

 

 

 

Great info thanks mate. I have been fishing for 50 years but still have so much to learn... 

[Ed.]

10 minutes ago, Drop Bear said:

Great info thanks mate. I have been fishing for 50 years but still have so much to learn... 

You and me both!