Invicta hybrid lithium batteries, any tried one?

[Bob9863]

I'm just awaiting delivery of one of the new little 5 door Suzuki Jimny 4x4's.

I've been looking at the upgrades I want to put on it and a car fridge is must for me, cold drinks, weekend meals and of course keeping fish cold on the way home.

I was going to put an under seat 60ah lithium system in but while I was at the 4x4 shop today they showed me the Invicta range of under bonnet lithium hybrid batteries.

It works as a normal starter battery but doubles as a deep cycle battery. It keeps a reserve amount so you never have to worry about running it flat. 

But I've got zero experience with something like this, and I'd love to know if someone has tried one or something similar before and what their experience has been like.

[mangajack]

Things to consider with Lithium batteries.

They do not handle high temps well.

They definitely do not like cold to sub zero temps....Will you need to start the car early morning in sub zero temps?

Is your Jimny charging system suitable for the Lithiums and it's BMS?

From what I can see lithiums are best suited from 8c to 35c.

What extremes of temp will you likely encounter?

Invicta has been around for a long time and well regarded....unfortunately nearly everything you see on the net will be a sales pitch for them.

[Bob9863]

I had considered the high temperature which these were built for, but I failed to think about low temperatures.

I'm not to worried about high temperatures, I've followed some long time use (independent) with use in the desert, but not much about use in cold climates.

But another thing to consider is if it's under bonnet then it's not really going to get any colder then if it's under the seat, which is my only other option.

One way or another I have to go lithium.

I know it gets to -5 to -8 at night, but if I know that and expect it then I can wrap it if I'm concerned. But my mate runs a lot of lithium batteries there without much trouble, when we are there to watch them. There has been trouble with them when nobody is there, but a lot of that has to do with the solar.

This battery won't have a problem with the jimny alternator as its 65amp and the battery is built to run on up to large high amp alternators in big 4x4's.

I don't need it to start 1st thing in the morning when its cold, I don't, I put wood on the fire and drink more coffee until the day warms up.

But there will be times that I will, I'm sure. But it won't be often either. And it won't be used as deep cycle often either.

1 positive is its got 1000cca, the usual lead acid battery in the jimny is 480cca, so if it is a little slow it should still be well above what's needed.

But I'm definitely going to ask them about it's performance in the cold, and confirm about the alternator.

Cheers for that.

[ellicat]

60 Ah may not be enough to run your fridge for long enough (say overnight in winter) if your fridge is a decent size ??

[Huxstang]

Invicta are a great brand…7 year warranty on straight LIFEPO, says a lot.

The new hybrids I have not looked at sorry but like all compromises - its a compromise :-))

Personally I say run a separate LIFEPO for your camping etc and safeguard cranking for just that.  100ah with say a 40l Engel (2amp draw) is 2 days without charging as they run down to basically 90% capacity.  

[Bob9863]

That is a concern of mine but I only run a 35-40lt fridge, currently I've been running a waeco 35lt for over 10 years now, I always use a 300w solar blanket, I never just let a fridge run on battery for longer then over night without putting charge in.

I currently run a 100ah AGM and it has dropped to 50% yet.

Even if I have to switch on the vehicle and charge it with the DC/DC system.

The advantage of this is it charges directly from the alternator, so it charges fast. If you do drop it down low enough the BMS shuts it off with 15% charge in reserve. You then either press a button on the battery, or using the app you press the jump start button and it switches the reserve current on to get the vehicle started (I think about what my tiny lithium jump start unit can do) then the alternator pumps the current back in.

I wouldn't use one if I ran lights and an inverter, but for just a small fridge it should be quite good (in theory at this poibt) It's been a hard concept to get my head around after using AGM'S for so many years, but new technology is becoming a bit of a game changer.

This comes with only a 3 year warranty, but that makes me wonder if it might be worth risking as if it proves to be not up to the task I can replace it. I would definitely be taking my 100ah smart battery box system with me the 1st few trips, and on extended trips until I was sure it would work or not.

I'm still looking into it, but it would solve some space and storage issues with a jimny.

It's definitely not a long time or heavy draw option, and they did say that, it's designed pretty much for my situation, but the downside is that doesn't leave a lot of room for error, so it is something you have to constantly watch, although I already do that now.

[Bob9863]

Oh one down side, apparently some smart DC/DC charger don't work well with it as they will pump some current in a few seconds at a time every few minutes, but they work perfectly if you run two of them.

So not ideal for many situations, but possibly perfect for others. I'm probably 80% sold on the concept ATM.

[Bob9863]

I thought I might open this up a bit, as a test I've been running my car fridge on a 60ah kings lithium battery to see what it uses, so far I put it on over 4 hours ago when the battery was at 13.5v, it's now at 13.4v which is pretty damn good.

I'm running it for 20 hours on freeze with a 2lt bottle of water in it as a heavy load test.

If it only drops by .3v by tonight it opens up my options quite a bit. I now have 3 options that I can think of.

1) the cheapest, put a century overlander dual purpose battery (AGM) in it to be a start battery and run the fridge.

2) spend the extra coin and put the Invicta hybrid battery in to do the same thing.

3) put an underseat 60ah slimline dual battery system in it.

My main objective here is to save space, not necessarily money, if I did try the Overlander battery it would most likely just be to test the system out for a few months before putting in the Invicta lithium.

I will open the floor to thoughts and opinions, bear in mind it will only run for 10 hours max without power going into it.

[Huxstang]

Bob,

With lithium voltage is not a good indicator of capacity as they hold voltage much longer.  Only way of knowing capacity is using a shunt that measure state of charge (enerdrive and victron for example).

I just had a look at history off my Victron shunt in the boat….after a long day out in salt water using the leccy, my lithium bank for the electric was sitting at 13.31v and had consumed 39.8Ah which represents as 80% State of Charge at 100% state of charge it is 13.35v.  So important to consider low drop in voltage is not representative of the batteries state of charge with lithium unlike FLA batteries.

Out of interest, a Landcruiser forum I follow had a thread today on issues with the itechworld lithium rated for under bonnet use.  They cut out at 60* at the terminals and wont come back on until returning to a static lower temp.  These aren’t a hybrid like you are talking about but something to consider if they do have an overtemp condition. (That said I think a TD 200 series underbonnet is significantly higher than your Suzuki!!)

I do think you will find a 40l Waeco consumes only @ 2.5amps once cool and when its cool they cycle much less (at least my 40l Engel does).  So with it running off solar during day and the battery recharging (you can normally get @ 8-10amps out of a solar blanket) in sunshine) the 60amp lithium which can run down to 90% capacity ie 54amps should give you roughly 21hrs as a minimum without charging.  Throw in a slim 100amp lithium and its more like double that.  

 

[Bob9863]

I'd love to put in a 100ag lithium, but unfortunately it won't fit anywhere.

I can put in a smart battery box, but that will take up a lot of space.

Best options are the under bonnet lithium hybrid (60ah) or a 70ah century overlander lead acid, or a 60ah under seat lithium with a BCDC Charger.

[Bretto77]

The fire issue (although generally statistically low) concerns me with lithium batteries. I don't think I would like to be sitting on top of one in an enclosed space if something went wrong. I would keep any batteries under bonnet or somehow external.

That said I drove a 95 model sierra for years when I was young. Bought it brand new and it never let me down. Wow, the places that you can get one of those things. Suzuki will have improved on that now because they don't do crap. I trust you will be impressed with the reliability and the places that you can get to in the jimny

[Bob9863]

This is my 5th suzuki, one stockman, 3 Sierra's and a gen 3 jimny.

I'm well acquainted with them, and absolutely love them. I'm twick as glad that I bought a 2024 model as next year they are going bigger again, wider, big tyres and the same 1.5lt engine.

I think this one will become a classic.

But back to the fridge testing, I did the same test again today but on the middle setting where I usually run it.

Started at 13.5v, dropped to 13.3 again, but here's the big twist, it only took 15min to top up the battery. That's bugger all amps, not thatcit was axhot day but still.

I think I will be able to get away with running a Century overlander 70ah under the bonnet, and run the fridge on that, I will use a voltage cut out but I think I should ve fine for a weekend getaway with a 300w solar blanket.

[mangajack]

Does the Jimny still run the 1.3l barina engine?

I did 750,000 m in my '85 drover/sierra   couldn't stop the little truck.

 

 

[Bob9863]

No the new ones got a 1.5lt and 15 extra kilowatts of power.