Help with sheared bolt.... reward offered.

[Eug]

Hi guys, thought I'd put it out to the wealth of knowledge that's on AFO.

I've got a sheared bolt on the outboard (for the torque tab/sacrificial anode), obviously found out the hard way about stainless steel's strength.

Tried to use an easy out bolt extractor but it just just snapped off inside the bolt, pretty sure I've removed most of what's left of it but there might be a few pieces in there. Much to my mate's disgust he reckons the bolt extractors are ALWAYS useless.

Now I have two options:

1. Build (weld) the bolt back up through the center of a nut and hope the heat frees up the bolt and just use a socket.

2. Go at it carefully with a dremel and hope the remnants of the bolt extractor bit don't get in the way.

There'll be a carton and/or reimbursement for anyone that can help me get it sorted, alternatively pointing me in the right direction would help.

Will have the pics up shortly.

Thanks

Eug

P.S. - I'd also like to learn to weld so wouldn't mind some tafe courses to check out. As well as suggestions on how to avoid a sheared bolt in future?

[bootyinblue]

I will tell you my suggestion after you put up a picture....... of my case of Bundy

[Eug]

pics up... i believe it is an M5 bolt or thereabouts.

[Eug]

I will tell you my suggestion after you put up a picture....... of my case of Bundy

here you go

[dhess]

A photo would be very helpful.

My plan of attack would be to heat it and let it cool down. Its amazing how many seized bolts will come out fairly easily after a few hot cold cycles. Spray the hell out of it with penetrating oil. Loctite makes one. Not sure where I got my last can but think it was from a bearing shop.

If at all possible cut a slot in it using your dremel so you can have a go at it with a large flat blade screw driver. Get it hot again before trying to undo it. If at possible try to get the outside portion hotter so it expands around the bolt. Not sure if this is applicable/possible in your situation.

[dhess]

OK a bit trickier. Disregard what I said.

I would drill the remanants of the screw out.

Retap to a larger thread diameter. Enlarge bolt hole on anode to accomodate larger bolt. Apply duralac and bolt on.

Should never sieze again.

[Eug]

Thanks Dom, sounds a bit fiddly and not what I was hoping for but might be the way to go.

Any other suggestions about building the bolt back up with weld? That's another suggestion a mate has given me.

[dhess]

Building the bolt up with weld sounds near impossible on an M5. Doubt it would be strong enough anyway to move a seized bolt.

If you are after an easy fix just zip tie the anode on.

[Bi_polar]

There are 2 different types of easy outs Eug. I generally find the tapered ones not much chop but use the straight splined ones all the time with great success. There are a few different companies that make them.... Rigid are the cheapest i think.

If you can use a Dremel and grind through one side of the hole till you get to the thread and then use somethink like a small strong screwdriver you might be able to collapse the screw inside its self.

You probably need to drill all the way throught the bolt first though. Start with a small drill and get it as centre as possible.

Good luck

[dhess]

You could also just cut your losses and get a specialist to sort it out. There are mobile thread repair guys that mechanics use. Not sure how much they charge.

They will pretty much drill it out tap it and put an insert with the original thread size in.

[Eug]

Dom: Yeah an M5 seems a bit small, a mate reckons it's the way to go but he's just recently had a baby and I don't want to bother him.

Stu: It was a tapered one, useless and I'll probably never use one again. Caused more grief than anything. I'm thinking cobalt drill bits?

[thriller]

my fav easy out is the snap-on easy out.

Mine are rusty as, but work time after time after time.

Not like the one shot tapered jobs.

"penetrene" the shank, then use the heat suggestion, (don't breath the fumes quite toxic)

[jeff f]

sorry eug but you'll never get a weld to hold there is not enough parent metal after you drilled it out

drill it out, tap it one size bigger and put in a hellicoil

[jnewy]

drill smaller hole then use an easy-out

[regulated]

She will be a bugger to drill with a snapped off eazy out in there already. The drills will want to slide off into the softer metal on the side unless you go very slow. As others have said step it up slowly. It you get it dead centre you may be lucky and get a good hole pretty close to the threads. with heat, oils and even freeze spray on just the bolt you may be able to lever out the thread with some small screwdrivers.

Seized bolts are never an easy operation.

[Bommie]

I've have tap & die set if you want to use it

[Eug]

I've have tap & die set if you want to use it

thanks mate. where did you get it from? i should probably get a set myself.

[bootyinblue]

Just thinking Eug, its a bolt that passes through the motor plate and secures into the sacrificial anode. Is there even a thread where it passes through the motor plate?

Warm it up a bit, lots of lube and punch it straight through

What motor is it as someone might be able to spin a quick spanner on theirs so that we have matching pairs, I mean so that they can confirm or deny.

[Bommie]

I've have tap & die set if you want to use it

thanks mate. where did you get it from? i should probably get a set myself.

old skool, it is my father's and was his, good quality

[Eug]

Just thinking Eug, its a bolt that passes through the motor plate and secures into the sacrificial anode. Is there even a thread where it passes through the motor plate?

Warm it up a bit, lots of lube and punch it straight through

What motor is it as someone might be able to spin a quick spanner on theirs so that we have matching pairs, I mean so that they can confirm or deny.

Greg, there is a threaded section where it attaches on the motor plate. Think of the sacrificial anode as a washer, it's held on via little notches (to lock it's directionality as a torque tab) and otherwise held on by the head of the bolt. It's a merc 40 2 banger if that helps.

Before I drill it out, going to see if i can get a notch into there and use a flat blade to screw it out. How do people suggest I go about heating it up without ruining the paintwork on the outboard?

[bootyinblue]

Ohh ok... I was thinking the anode might have been tapped and it screwed into that.

Now I am confused, will have to go and look at my motor for more ideas.

[billythakid]

gas soldering iron , little butane torch looking thing would be the easiest ,

similar to this from bunnings around $10 clams

here you go http://www.bunnings.com.au/products_product_pocket-torch_1664.aspx?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=a+soldering+iron&utm_campaign=Other%7cTools%26Hardware%7cPowertools&filter=categoryname--Soldering+%26+Blow+Torches

[Eug]

let me know greg.

thanks billy... looks like i'll need to get some more tools.

[BassTracker]

She will be a bugger to drill with a snapped off eazy out in there already. The drills will want to slide off into the softer metal on the side unless you go very slow. As others have said step it up slowly. It you get it dead centre you may be lucky and get a good hole pretty close to the threads. with heat, oils and even freeze spray on just the bolt you may be able to lever out the thread with some small screwdrivers.

Seized bolts are never an easy operation.

caN you buy freeze spray? that would make a big dif, ??

[Eug]

found out there's mobile thread removal blokes who come to you. might be the go considering i'd have to buy a few extra things.

[bootyinblue]

Isnt that Brian?

Ohhhh ok different kind of thread ;-)

[shortie]

Isnt that Brian?

Ohhhh ok different kind of thread ;-)

He isnt that mobile but he will definatelly be late.

[Bi_polar]

Isnt that Brian?

Ohhhh ok different kind of thread ;-)

Hahaha.....Love it

[Bi_polar]

If you get stuck Eug, i have a workshop here with all the gear to fix it your more than welcome to come over and we can do it.

[regulated]

She will be a bugger to drill with a snapped off eazy out in there already. The drills will want to slide off into the softer metal on the side unless you go very slow. As others have said step it up slowly. It you get it dead centre you may be lucky and get a good hole pretty close to the threads. with heat, oils and even freeze spray on just the bolt you may be able to lever out the thread with some small screwdrivers.

Seized bolts are never an easy operation.

caN you buy freeze spray? that would make a big dif, ??

yeah mate use it in our trade a bit, usually only small cans for electronics. Think its usually compressed CO2 for our purposes. As long as you only try to cool/freeze the bolt it may help. Works with bearings

[Eug]

If you get stuck Eug, i have a workshop here with all the gear to fix it your more than welcome to come over and we can do it.

Thanks mate, will see how I go this weekend.

[cookie_7]

if you can't get the old stud out, drill it out then helicoil.

[Damien2Rad]

Getting out broken bolts is one thing I am good at after a few years in a machine shop getting out the broken bolts of ham fisted diesel fitters.

The first thing that I'll point out is that ALL threads should be lubed prior to assembly. Not only does this actually allow the bolt to reach its required torque. It also acts as an anti sieze down the line.

Second. Never force a tight bolt out. If it doesn't come undone with reasonable force... Hit it with a punch and hammer. A lot! Hammers and a drift are probably the most underrated tool in the removal of bolts.

Same goes when you using an easy out. Don't just put it in there.. really bash the sucker in. Heat and penetrene are also good.

You really have to drill as close to the centre as possible too.

Sorry for the Captain Hindsight speech.

What I would do now is panic! Or persist. If you damaage the thread but get the whole bolt off you could always helicoil or go the next size thread up.

I find it hard to explain things online, sorry.

[Artifishal]

+1 for helicoil

[jared1979]

Easy outs are only good if the broken off bolt is loose as has already been said. Stainless has a really bad habit for binding up and no amount of pressure will free it.Shouldnt need to helicoil it providing you have removed all the easy out should be able to drill a 4.2mm hole and run a 5mm tap through it providing your hole is central.

[rastus]

my advice

wd40 the hell out of it for a couple of days

heat the parent material

spray the bolt with "cold in a can"

reverse drill bit to finish it off

also can you get at it from both sides?

edit: if the parent material is ally you should be able to get it hot enough with boiling water to break the tension also might help penetrate the thread?

[Orca]

You could also just cut your losses and get a specialist to sort it out. There are mobile thread repair guys that mechanics use. Not sure how much they charge.

They will pretty much drill it out tap it and put an insert with the original thread size in.

Mobile Threadfix - Steve- 0409 584 022 - I think he charges $85 call out including 30 mins labour. An excellent outcome is guaranteed.

[Eug]

got it sorted, a mate also recommended steve. took him well close to an hour. we speculated that poor preparation prior to insertion of the bolt (i.e. duralac or anti-seize) lead to the issue. went through around 4-5 burrs and suspected that there was other hardened pieces in there (since he had already got the snapped drill bit out).

$160 later have now got a timesert in there and it should never happen again.

cheers for all the help and thanks to bommie and lance for offering tools, etc.

eug

[haines490slc]

Isnt that Brian?

Ohhhh ok different kind of thread ;-)

hahhaahahah :silly:

[Davo_Dinkum]

Getting out broken bolts is one thing I am good at after a few years in a machine shop getting out the broken bolts of ham fisted diesel fitters.

The first thing that I'll point out is that ALL threads should be lubed prior to assembly. Not only does this actually allow the bolt to reach its required torque. It also acts as an anti sieze down the line.

Second. Never force a tight bolt out. If it doesn't come undone with reasonable force... Hit it with a punch and hammer. A lot! Hammers and a drift are probably the most underrated tool in the removal of bolts.

Same goes when you using an easy out. Don't just put it in there.. really bash the sucker in. Heat and penetrene are also good.

You really have to drill as close to the centre as possible too.

Sorry for the Captain Hindsight speech.

What I would do now is panic! Or persist. If you damaage the thread but get the whole bolt off you could always helicoil or go the next size thread up.

I find it hard to explain things online, sorry.

too true ,spent years rebuild starters and alternators ally body's and steel bolts ,a punch and impact driver are your best friend .